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Joyce DiDonato in London:  The American mezzo talks to Margarida Mota-Bull (MMB)

Photograph © Sheila Rock, courtesy of Virgin Classics

Joyce DiDonato, is in London for two concerts at Wigmore Hall: on Tuesday, 26th and on Thursday, 28th January 2010, both at 19.30. This interview was conducted before the concerts, on 12th January 2010, in the Gerald Moore Room at the Wigmore Hall, in London.

How did you become interested or when did you decide you wanted to be a musician and an opera singer? Did you have any influences in your family?

JDD: I don’t know that I ever thought I could actually be a professional musician. It was something that seemed like a very distant dream, so I never dared put much hope in it. But music was always a part of my life. My father was a church choir director and I grew up singing in all the choirs and musicals in high school. It was such a wonderful escape for me! I immediately loved the entire element of the music; the intellectual side of it; the linguistic element, the emotional impact. So, I went to college to become a music teacher, which was a sensible, very achievable goal. I think it was during my third year in college that I began studying voice because I thought I should learn how to teach singing and I started figuring out the instrument of the body, which is quite a natural, organic thing, which surprised me because when I heard opera singers then, I heard something like “OOO...OOO” [she makes a howling sound] and I first thought: what is that sound? I didn’t understand it. I mean sonically, I didn’t get it. Instead, it was coming from the inside out and that really captured me. I had always loved being on the stage; so, opera was kind of a very natural evolution for me. But truthfully, it took me completely by surprise. It really enthralled me that I found myself on an opera stage and enjoying it; so, I decided: I was about 21 or 22, and I thought: I’m going to give this a shot and see what happens.

I’m glad you did.

JDD: Thank you. It’s funny how things like that work out!

I read an article on Opera News (the Diva edition), which stated that you were once told by a judge at a song competition in London that (and I quote) “you had nothing to offer as an artist”. He must be eating his hat now if he has one! Anyway, it really seems like an outrageous thing to say when one hears you sing at present.

JDD: I’m sure he doesn’t even remember it. I don’t think it was as big a deal to him as it was to me at the time.

Yes, that's what I wanted to know: How did you feel then? How did you overcome that kind of rejection?

I was devastated. I was sincerely devastated and that’s the kind of thing that can really knock you down... as if you were a boxer and somebody punches you in the gut, and you’re down for the count. I didn’t have a great voice back then; I honestly didn’t know how to sing so well. So, I was used to criticisms like the voice is a little shrill or it’s too tight; or the German is a little “mish-mash” but I always believed that I had something to say, that I could communicate well. So, this was devastating to me and I thought: Well, I guess that’s it then! If I have nothing to say I’d better find another career! And then, at about the same time, I went back to my second year in the Houston programme. For various circumstances a role had been taken away from me and given to somebody else; I did a couple of auditions but I didn’t get any offers. It was all quite disheartening. I was absolutely in a vortex at the time. It lasted a few months and then I slowly pulled myself out of it; life started happening and my career started going on. However, that statement was always there, like a lightening bolt! But I’m the kind of person that after I get knocked down, I will actually steel myself up and I will say, “OK, you don’t think I have anything to say as an artist? I’m going to make sure that nobody can ever say that about me again!” So, I got a little bit defiant and became a bit intense on the stage. But actually what I think he was saying was: I arrived on the scene, here at Wigmore Hall, a very polished, perfect sort of... I won’t say plastic... but I was playing an opera singer, playing the part of a recitalist and everything was perfectly in place. I was standing with my hand on the piano “just so”, I was doing everything I had been told to do and it probably arrived as quite mechanical. In the end, he was probably right! In that moment what was coming across was something seemingly superficial even though I didn’t feel superficial, I thought I was doing everything you were supposed to do. I felt very strongly about the music, I loved it, I loved singing, I had done a lot of work on the poetry to say something, but at the time, at that age – I was 27, I guess – I thought you had to behave in a certain way and present yourself “as a diva”... that was my upbringing in the conservatory system and instead I think what I learned was: while yes, there is certain stage deportment which is expected, the most important element is to be myself. I have to be myself! So, in the end, what was originally devastating actually was quite liberating and it taught me exactly what I needed to learn; it gave me the impetus, the real kick in the behind to be myself, which has been an amazing thing. I can go on stage now... It’s much easier...Oh! God! It’s so much easier than trying to act like the diva or something! So, devastation turned into liberation, I guess. A long answer! Sorry!

: No, no, it’s fine. I enjoyed listening to it. Now, I would like to go through some of the composers you sing. Rossini! What does the composer mean to you? Why did you choose arias that he wrote for Colbran for your new CD? Do they suit your voice? And also the personal aspect: Rossini wrote many of his operas for Colbran but their marriage was not a happy one. After her death, he married Olympe Pélissier with whom he seemed to have had a more harmonious life. How important do you think it is for an artist such as Rossini and  yourself to have a happy private life and a supportive, harmonious relationship?

JDD: Oh! That’s a big question! Ah! Rossini has been very good to me in my career and he’s been, I’d say, one of two composers that I’ve been primarily associated with: Handel and Rossini. So, I answer the question actually including Handel as well.

: ..... I was going to ask you about Handel after.

JDD: Okay. I feel the same but slightly stronger about Handel in this regard, in that they have taught me first of all how to be a better singer, because you cannot sing that repertoire without having a solid technique. Or perhaps you can sing it for a little while but it’s going to break down quite quickly. It exposes without mercy any technical weakness you have, it also requires in my opinion that you are able to do everything: piano, forte, getting from piano to forte and back down to piano seamlessly, that you can sing nearly... not quite two and a half octaves but nearly two and a half octaves without any breaks or lumps. I consider Handel as a bel canto composer, for me, in terms of what is required of the singing. You have to be able to sing fast and clear, as well as to be able to sing slow and legato, AND fast and legato. So, Rossini and Handel have made me absolutely a better singer. They’ve challenged me in enormous ways and I LOVE that. The other thing is that I think they’ve made me a better artist. If you just look at the notes that they wrote and you simply sing the notes, it’s quite easy that it comes out as pure vocalising, as simple exercises for the voice, and it’s excruciating if you hear it sung that way! I can’t take it for more than about fifteen seconds. So, it’s not easy to find the expressive quality of the phrases; there’s a lot of repetition in each of the composers, especially Handel. The text is repeating all the time; you have a ten-minute aria and you have only four phrases to say; so, you have to find the bone marrow, the layers underneath the surface of the notes. So, by exploring that first with Handel, I think it fed me a lot of information for this Colbran disc. There’s a lot of deep music in this Rossini but it’s not necessarily obvious. I associate both composers very closely in what their vocal and musical requirements are, but also what their rewards are, because viscerally, to actually tear through a two-octave scale up and down chromatically... you know... in Rossini you get to the end and it’s like OOOOH! It’s quite thrilling! So, it’s really athletic, singing these kinds of things and like any athlete you get a rush of endorphins and it’s quite exhilarating if you get it right. But there’s a lot of pedantic, pedagogical, boring technical work to get to that point but that’s all right: you do the work and hopefully the reward is good.

Now, the next part of that question was about Colbran and Rossini. You know I find it fascinating, strictly from a musical standpoint, to put their relationship under the microscope. Obviously, he knew her very intimately not only as a woman but as an artist, as a singer and you hear that. I mean he gave her so much in these pieces; temperamentally he gave her such strong characters... I mean, my gosh, in America we thought the feminist revolution happened in the seventies! Hello! Armida? Semiramide? I mean, these are strong women. That’s what I always like about Rossini: He gives you such strong, wonderful women and, as a woman myself, it’s such a rush to sing a character like Armida; it’s amazing. And yet, you also see the tenderness that Rossini gave Colbran. For example, Desdemona, in Otello, with the Willow Song, those are moments a composer gives a singer simply to shine, not to impress with fireworks and pyrotechnics but to let the voice just unfold through sorrow, through imploration. So, even though it was a tempestuous relationship... how could it not be? You’ve got Rossini and this fiery Spanish diva, with what must have been a huge personality! I think people have different opinions about what makes up a personal life as an artist. There’s one school of thought that says you’ve got to suffer to be a real artist on the stage. I think suffering informs a lot about dramatic and musical choices for the stage but... I love singing and I love music but I also have a life, which I love as well. And at the end of my days, when I can’t sing anymore, which will happen [she knocks on wood and smiles] in a long time hopefully! I hope that at the end of the day I will have had a very satisfying, happy life and, in fact, I work very hard to make that a reality. I work very hard to keep balance and to keep joy in my life. It’s not always easy! Oh God! It’s not always easy but it’s a priority. It’s an absolute priority of mine... as long as I have access to... I mean... I’ve had pain... I’ve had a lot of pain in my life so I have access to those emotions. But I’m also happy if at the end of a performance people come away and they feel uplifted and they feel joy. I don’t think it’s a bad thing. I think as a matter of fact that in today’s world, it is a great and NECESSARY thing!

It is a great thing. I absolutely agree with you. Talking about your performances, I saw you in “Il Barbiere di Siviglia” as Rosina this summer at the ROH when you broke your leg. I also saw your DVDs as Dona Elvira in Mozart’s “Don Giovanni” and Handel’s “Hercules” as Dejanira. I watched your concert some time ago at the Barbican when you were promoting your CD of Handel’s “Arie di Furore”. Each time,  it seemed as  though the roles were written especially for you, a quality I found also in your recording of Handel’s “Alcina”. Is this intuitive because you like the music so much and you love to sing? Or is it dramatic training? Or simply hard work?

JDD: I’m not sure, to be honest, but it’s such a lovely comment! Thank you! I think it’s several things: I respect tremendously... well, I have a few friends who are composers and part of this comes from the modern work that I did in Houston; so, I’ve seen first hand the amount of work that it takes to compose, the passion that they possess for their work... I mean, perhaps I romanticise it now... whereas, you know, in Mozart’s day he needed to put chicken on the table... maybe it’s less romantic than I would like it to be! But I sincerely respect what they wrote. You know, I would say that ninety-eight times out of a hundred, I get to work on masterpieces, real masterpieces; so, I tend not to think that I know better than the composer. I think the composer did just fine... [she smiles] on his own! So I work very hard to truly look at the score and I try to carefully observe what’s been written, so perhaps that’s part of it. Another element is that I think I’m careful about what I choose. I don’t look at a list of standard roles for a lyric mezzo and say, “OK, so I should sing x, y and z.” I look at the repertoire and I say, “Oh! Actually that’s a good fit for my voice.” Donna Elvira, for example, if I look at the history of singers who have sung this role (Te Kanawa, Schwarzkopf, etc) I say “It can’t possibly be for me,” but if I really look at the score, I see that it just might be possible. I know the tradition of Mi tradi that Mozart wrote one version down a half a step, which makes a world of difference for my voice, and temperamentally I certainly get this woman; I understand her; I like her. Musically, vocally, if the conductor is on my side, I think I can have a really good success with this. So I did it! I also tend not to take on roles that if I could list for you... – I hope this doesn’t sound arrogant – but if I could name you five other people singing today that I would rather hear sing the role, I won’t do it. I’d rather hear them even if I could sing it, even if I could get through it. So, I try to take on things that I think resonate strongly with me, and which I think I have something to say with it, that I identify with, either musically or dramatically; and that excite me. There’s really no role yet which I have performed that hasn’t excited me. I love to sing, as you said, I love being given the chance to live with these characters who are so amazing... I mean Cherubino, Dejanira, Donna Elvira, Alcina, they’re so immensely different and they’re so extraordinary. I respect them as human beings; I respect who they are; I get their sufferings; I get their deficiencies; I get their frailties; I get their strengths, and I love them all the more for it. It’s such a privilege to step into those shoes for a couple of hours! I’m so lucky.

Looking at your repertoire you sing Rossini, Handel who both have bel canto roots; you sing classics like Mozart and Haydn; you made a recording of Berlioz’s Benvenuto Cellini but you also sing Strauss and many modern composers for whom you created roles like for example Meg in Mark Adamo’s Little Women. Could you comment on this particular work?


JDD: Well, the first time I did Little Women, I was still in the studio of the Houston Opera and, you know, when you’re young and when you’re a student, you’re slightly arrogant and you think, “Who is this man and how is he going to do Little Women? Bla, bla, bla!” And we didn’t realise how good it was when we were in the middle of it. It was difficult; it was very hard vocally for everybody. So each of us were pushed to our limits a bit. We were getting the music quite late so we didn’t have a lot of preparation time and we just couldn’t see how it was going to be a worthwhile piece. Of course we knew! We were so smart! And then we got in front of an audience for the first time, it was an open dress rehearsal, and they started laughing. We heard actual laughter coming from the theatre! It was supposed to be comical in spots, but we weren’t getting it; we were all a bit sour on it and the audience was really laughing and we thought: “Oh…whatever!” And so we continued and as we got further along into the opera, from the stage, we started to hear people crying and – you know the death of Amy is very poignant and the ending quartet for the women is just beyond beautiful – and we were all just absolutely blindsided by the reaction from the audience. So then, it came back two years later and it was almost all the same cast and we were all, of course, saying: “This is genius; don’t you know it’s great? We knew it right from the beginning!” [She laughs, making fun of herself]. So, we did the opera again! The beautiful thing is that we were a close group of friends in the studio; we’d been training together for a number of years; we knew each other quite well and, as I talked to other people who had done the opera as well... we saw... well, that it really has this quality that brings you very close, as a cast. You really feel like sisters and friends up on the stage and I think the audience feels it as well. So, it was amazing to be part of a historic American novel, an American story, and to present something that was beautiful; that really touched people. It was surprising. But... I, well... I REALLY wanted to be Jo.

I was going to ask you that. Did you really have a preference?

Oh! Yes! The original idea was for me to sing Jo and I got taken off of it and they promptly “demoted” me to Meg. Oh, I hated the idea, because I come from a big family; I’m sixth of seven children; I have five sisters; I was a bit of a Tom-boy; it was supposed to be a big coloratura role; it was the lead... and I thought: Oh! I AM Jo and then I got demoted to Meg... I was devastated... and of course, in the end it ended up being the right, the absolutely right role for me.

In your live performances, you always appear to give it everything, with a generosity that I have not very often seen in other operatic artists. Is this because you have hard times behind you until you got to the top? Also I’ve seen your performances, read your interviews and you never came across as a big “diva”, [she laughs] as a lot of your colleagues (both female and male) are more often than not. Is that a conscious thing that you don’t become a “diva” in the negative sense of the word?

JDD: Extremely conscious and it’s slightly reactionary... but no, it’s extremely conscious and it goes back to your earlier question about the kind of life that I want to live. It’s a lot of work – maybe I’m just lazy – but it’s a lot of work to uphold a persona off stage as well as on. I tried that costume on for a while, believing that you had to be a certain thing, and it just doesn’t fit me. AND it’s exhausting work! It’s absolutely not for me. I felt like I had to take a shower afterwards; I had to take off my stage “diva” make up. And you know? My time on stage is precious and brilliant and people have paid a lot of money to attend a performance, so I should give it everything because if I don’t... Well, I mean if you paid £300 a seat and I only give you eighty percent; you deserve twenty percent of your money back! That’s the way I think about it. My time on stage is in character and everything is for the audience. But then I think it’s only fair that I shouldn’t have to play a role off-stage as well. It’s too tiring; and I can’t see the merit in it. I don’t see how it can be rewarding. It can be rewarding for a while but it’s artificially rewarding. For a little bit you get loads of flowers, you get your picture on the newspaper... you know, whatever the rewards are... But I prefer to experience this wonderful, wacky journey of being an opera singer as myself. It’s just much less complicated!

Haydn: “Scena di Berenice” – you sang it at the Proms last summer. It’s beautiful but you made it an unforgettable experience. What do you feel about this piece of music?

JDD: Oh! I love it! It’s such a gift from Haydn. You know Ch’io mi scordi di te, from Mozart? It’s very similar; it’s the same kind of thing outside of the operatic repertoire. It’s written by a composer who obviously loved singers and loved what the voice could do and who gives you everything in that piece. Scena di Berenice is highly dramatic. OK, maybe you don’t get any comedy, but you get real declamatory, strong recitatives; you get aching pathos and lyricism and beauty of melody, beauty of line, and then you get to sort of, you know, to tear the roof off the place! Again, another very strong woman, fiery but fragile and vulnerable at the same time... but she doesn’t let that defeat her. And strictly speaking, just from a musical standpoint, I mean it’s Haydn at his best. It’s everything that made Haydn great - that period of real classicism, you know, there’s a purity about it, which is why it can still speak to people today; there’s a purity in it, in the music... It’s just so right. To sing it with the Orchestra of the Age of Enlightenment... it was just heaven!

You have been compared by some critics to Marilyn Horne and Teresa Berganza; not because you imitate them but because you have an amazing range and a depth in your acting which those singers were both famous for. Do you agree with this comparison?

JDD: No. No, I mean, it astonishes me to have my name put along side them, because for me, you know, they’re absolute icons. But actually, I think, it’s more calling attention to the fact that we share similar repertoire with a real attention and devotion to Rossini and Handel. Marilyn Horne certainly put these composers back on the map almost single-handedly. The fact that there’s an audience for this repertoire right now is largely due to her and to Berganza. (I love being compared to such a fabulous, Spanish lady.) They’re both fiercely brilliant women, strong women so, I mean, it’s quite a compliment to be put on the same level but... vocally, I think we are quite different characters.

Are there any composers that you think you cannot sing?

: Puccini. Puccini.


MMB: Somehow I had a hunch that that was what you were going to say.

Hum, yes! I wish I could! I also don’t see myself going into Verdi. Again there are other people I’d rather hear sing that. Yeah! From the big ones I think those are the two that should be left to other people... sadly! Not that I wouldn’t want to!

What about Donizetti or Bellini? I don’t think I’ve ever heard you sing those!

JDD: Actually, I did my first Romeo about two years ago in Paris and loved it. I will do my first Adalgisa this summer in Salzburg. I have also sung Elisabetta in Maria Stuarda a few years ago in Geneva and I will take on the title role in a few seasons at the Met. So I see more bel canto in my future. They’re... I mean Donizetti and Bellini are the natural successors to Handel and Rossini.

You call yourself “Yankee Diva” in your blog and your e-mail address! I think it’s a great name with humour and style but may I ask why you chose it?

JDD: It sort of morphed into the something that it is now [she laughs.]. It happened back in the days... – I was married before – My husband was a big Yankees fan. Back then you didn’t have multiple e-mail accounts; you had one! So, he took the “yankee”, I took the “diva” and we put them together and it kind of worked out that way. I suppose over time I’ve grown into it on my own. I didn’t actually set out to identify myself as a “yankee diva”! I sort of went like: Oh! Yeah! That actually really fits me. I like that. It’s catchy!

: Do you have a role model? A singer that you look up to? Either in the present or in the past.

JDD: You know, my answer to that is always Frederica von Stade. She’s – and this is why I’m very flattered by some of the things you said earlier – because what I find with her is that she is such a generous performer. When I’m in the audience or I’m watching something with her, what comes across to me is absolute generosity: she’s giving everything to the public and not asking for a single thing back in return. My personal taste for performers is not somebody who asks the public: “Please tell me I’m great. That was good, right?” Somebody who is not a needy performer. I don’t want to have to make a performer feel okay about their performance; I want them to make me feel something and I always felt that in relation to her. With Flicka, her priority is the music and the emotion and sharing that; she's not holding any of it for herself. And also, actually, the voice melts my heart; there’s humanity in that voice; it’s not manufactured; it’s real! She is also the most generous human being on the face of the planet. She’s an extraordinary, extraordinary lady with a wicked sense of humour. I don’t think she takes herself so seriously. So, it’s all those things that have always resonated with me.

What about your male colleagues, somebody you like to sing with; that you think there is real chemistry on stage?

JDD: Hmm! Oh! I hate to single anybody out.....


MMB:...... You don’t have to answer if you don’t want to.

Well, I will say that it is always something special to share the stage with Larry Brownlee. I’ll never forget when he had his debut at the MET and it was the second run of Barbers for me; I had done the first run and in the second run, he was stepping into it and he had his debut... Do you actually know Larry Brownlee?

Yes, Lawrence Brownlee, right?

Yes! Lawrence Brownlee. He is about this tall [she indicates somebody quite short]; he’s black and he was a little pudgy at the time and he’s not somebody that an agent would look at and say: “You’re going to have a great career!”

But he has a lovely voice.

Oh my god! Doesn’t he just? And he’s an exceptional musician and he’s the greatest guy on the face of the planet. He sang Cessa di più resistere and blew the roof off the place. He stood there for five minutes taking the applause and I had tears streaming down my face because he’s somebody who had a lot (I mean a LOT!) of obstacles in front of him and yet I never once ever heard him make an excuse for himself, or to begrudge other people for making his road difficult; he’s always taken the high road. He has such class and sincerity about him. The next performance was the day after my mother had died and I had stayed on to sing that show and then went home for the funeral and for a variety of reasons... it was terribly difficult, but was the right choice in the end. Anyway, when I got to the theatre, there was a bouquet of flowers from him and he said: “Tonight, I dedicate my performance to your Mom.” And I just thought here’s somebody... you know? He had loads of family and friends in from everywhere and there’s a lot of pressure and attention on a debut at the Met – he had plenty of other things on his mind. And yet here he was reaching out to me as a friend and the support I felt from him that night and the joy of having watched and been a part of his debut was very special. He’s very special! He’s an incredibly special human being.

: Here at Wigmore Hall you are singing a programme of songs from a great variety of composers -  organised under the topic “Over Three Centuries of Italian Love Songs”. Could you please comment on some of the less obvious choices? Like Beethoven for example!

JDD: It is very interesting because Beethoven was the nucleus for this recital. John Gilhooly , the director of Wigmore Hall, said to me: “You need to sing these songs!” But I didn’t know them, so, I looked at them and I thought: Oh! Actually, they sound like Mozart! They’re so Mozartian, it’s incredible! They’re just great! There are two in which he uses the exact same text, yet sets it in two completely different ways: one is a buffo aria and the other is larghetto and quite sincere. So, I thought: How fabulous to take the same text and set it in two different ways! I love that kind of stuff. So, I started with Beethoven and then John also said: “Arie antiche! I’d like to hear you sing those.” So I began thinking: How can I make a recital around this? What do I do? Throw in some Debussy? I don’t know. So, I stayed in the Italian school and started looking at a lot of music, I mean, a lot of music! I came across these 20th century pieces that I didn’t know – I had never heard about Francesco Santoliquido, for example – as well as a number of other obscure pieces but... Well, come to think of it I remember some of these people, these composers were fascists and got pushed out to the side quite quickly, but years later, their music is still around. So as I searched I realised: Oh, my gosh: there’s more than 3 centuries of music here... Bingo! It is actually a perfect reflection of my career: I go from very early music to the most contemporary. So, I thought that’s actually a real reflection on who I am as an artist. I then looked for a thread to connect these pieces through the centuries while demonstrating how the music had developed. I’m always very frightened when I first bring out a recital because you’re putting together an immense programme that’s never been heard before and you don’t get a chance to test it out before you present it – I mean, I have to present my programme months and months in advance – and before I have the chance to put it all together, rehearse it, make sure it’s cohesive; it’s decided. So, I get nervous and I think: Oh! I hope it works! Anyway, one of the things for me with this programme is that I’ve done many challenging recitals before: with American music, contemporary music, mad scenes, etc. So, I thought, “this time I just want to sing melodies!” And I was able to choose selections on a theme of love: either celebrating it, or scorning it, or rejecting it or laughing at it. When you think of Italy, you think amore... and I’ve ended up with a lot of really beautiful melodies. My fear is that it will end up being too light of an evening but I figured... you know, January, grey skies... let’s bring in some Mediterranean sun and warm things up. I think it’s good for people just to be able to enjoy the melodies.

: You just said “too light an evening”.  You’re not one of those people that thinks opera singers should only sing opera?

I don’t know! Sometimes there’s a certain pressure for that.


MMB: I’m thinking about your CD of Spanish music “¡Pasión!”, which is not really opera as such but it’s a wonderful CD. Very lively, very fiery and very passionate as the name indicates...

JDD: Thank you! There’s so much wonderful repertoire out there. No, I don’t think that we only have to do opera. I think you look at my CV and it’s obvious that I don’t like to be contained in a small box. I have a big musical appetite; I have a big artistic appetite and I think that having all those elements combined make me a better artist; it’s just my temperament! It’s what works well for me. But this one, this recital, I think it’s going to be kind of relaxed, you know, just sort of indulgent... My fear is that it’s too much sugar but, you know, we need that! Like I said it’s the winter; it’s the grey of winter and I just want people to come and revel in the tunes and the melody.

Great. I’m looking forward to it


JDD: Oh! I hope you’ll enjoy it


MMB: I’m sure I will. There is yet to come something sung by you that I didn’t enjoy.


JDD: Oh! Thank you. That’s very kind.

Margarida Mota-Bull

Margarida Mota-Bull's operatic e-novel, Canto de Tenore is available Here


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